Mr. Magazine

A Mr. Magazine™ Launch Story…

“Sometimes I stop and wonder if I’ve gone a bit crazy, but I think those segments of millennials and younger people who are really into things that are a little bit retro, and who want authenticity and something that they can actually touch and hold; perhaps they even have a little bit of Internet fatigue, you know? There is a lot of scope for a magazine like ROVA, which is a niche area for these millennials who are out there on the road traveling. What I’m hoping is that it sticks to them and they enjoy reading it every few months.” Gemma Peckham (On whether she’s out of her mind for launching a print magazine for millennials)…

RV’s and millennials, the two haven’t necessarily gone together in the past, but a new title called ROVA thinks that they certainly do conjoin on today’s modern roadmaps. Gemma Peckham is a publisher and editor who works for an Australian company that has decided the United States has the right canvas to paint this particular portrait of millennials and RV’s on. And from the feedback she said she is receiving from the magazine’s premiere issue, they seem to be right.

I spoke with Gemma recently and we talked about the uniqueness of the concept. The premise is many millennials and Gen Xer’s are taking to the open road to work, explore and experience authentic, retro life. It’s a niche area usually reserved for retirees, but Gemma said that is no longer the case. From research she conducted herself; she discovered that RV buyers in the U.S. were getting younger by the mile and were off to find epic adventure in their homes on wheels.

Gemma herself is a digital nomad, as she describes younger people who like to jump in an RV and go, she loves road travel and she loves print magazines. And she believes that many millennials are a bit Internet fatigued, as she puts it, and Mr. Magazine™ would have to agree with her. There is nothing like the tangible print experience.

So, grab your paper map and your homey RV and let’s hit the road with Gemma Peckham, publisher and editor, ROVA magazine.

But first the sound-bites:

On whether she thinks she’s out of her mind for launching a print magazine for millennials: (Laughs) That is a very good question, and one that I’ve been asked numerous times. Sometimes I stop and wonder if I’ve gone a bit crazy, but I think those segments of millennials and younger people who are really into things that are a little bit retro, and who want authenticity and something that they can actually touch and hold; perhaps they even have a little bit of Internet fatigue, you know? There is a lot of scope for a magazine like ROVA, which is a niche area for these millennials who are out there on the road traveling. What I’m hoping is that it sticks to them and they enjoy reading it every few months.

On what her thinking was behind the premise of RV traveling for millennials: I’m from Australia and it came about because I work at a publishing company there, which I’ve brought here to New York, and we had a magazine there for RV traveling and it was called “Caravanning Australia” and it was very targeted toward the retired market, the audience had an average age of about 60 or so. When I decided to come here and bring the company over to the states, I looked at RVing here, because obviously we have experience in that area. And I did a bit of research and one of the things that I discovered was that the largest group of people buying RV’s currently is between the ages of 35-44. So, the demographic is slowly, but surely getting younger.

On the biggest challenge she faced in launching this first issue: Number one for us is this is the very first magazine that we’ve made in the United States. So, in terms of just making people aware of who we are and what we do, and then also trying to communicate the idea for this magazine to them was a bit of a challenge. And I guess that relates to advertising as well, as you said, some people asked were we crazy for doing a print magazine for millennials who are RV enthusiasts. They thought it was a very strange concept.

On how she is combining her passion for the magazine with business: In ROVA’s case, this is both. The stories that we have here and the kind of content that I’m curating for the magazine is really what I would like to read and other travelers that I know would like to read. We’ve created the design so that it appeals to people in my age group. But by the same token, I’m fully aware of the fact that we really need to make sure that what we’re putting into the magazine is really appealing to advertisers, because without them it’s not going to work.

On the future and other plans in the works: We definitely have more plans. ROVA is obviously our flagship publication at the moment, it’s the one we’ve been able to promote and it’s doing quite well. We think it’s doing quite well from the feedback we’re getting. The plan for ROVA is just to grow it, make it bigger and get it out there, and build on that. But Executive Media Global is a publishing company that’s based on a model in Australia where we have 50 or 60 different titles that we produce every year.

On her plan for connecting ROVA with its audience: Digital is a big part of it for us, simply because that’s where millennials and Gen Xer’s go to get their information. Other than that, we’re going toward a number of RV shows. For example, Escapees, which is a big RV club and they have a big yearly event. So, we have a booth and we’re going out there, where we’ll actually be talking to people and connecting with them, and showing them the magazine. We have plans to do a few of those over the next few months to get this first edition out there.

On whether she found any differences in traveling with an RV in the United States versus Australia and New Zealand: It’s very similar in one way, which is the size of the country. The size of the U.S. is very similar to the size of Australia. Road trips are a really big part of the way people explore their own countries. So, that’s very similar, both here and in Australia.

On any plans to take the magazine to Australia: I don’t know. I believe Australia is moving in a similar direction with the age of the people who are taking up the RV way of traveling. It could work. I think probably what we would do, because this is a very U.S.-centric publication, we could potentially make an Australian focus, and I think that’s definitely something that isn’t out of the question. It’s something that we have the resources to do.

On anything she’d like to add: The main thing that I’m experiencing is I have been so overwhelmingly pleased with the feedback that we’ve gotten and the way that people receive new magazines here. It’s very different than t is in Australia; people really give you kudos if you have an idea and you take it to the market and if you have passion behind the product, I think that people react in a really positive way. And that’s something that I’ve been really surprised by; the support and encouragement that we’ve gotten for this magazine. And that’s one of the things that make me happiest and most satisfied doing this, just seeing the reaction from people. And feeling like that we’re on the right track.

On what someone would find her doing if they showed up unexpectedly to her home one evening: It will depend upon how hard the day was. After a very hard day, yes, it will be binge-watching TV and having a glass of wine. Otherwise, I know it’s very strange, since I work in publishing, but I like to read when I go home. I’ll read the latest book that has caught my attention, or just having dinner with my husband and chatting, just catching up on the day.

On what keeps her up at night: Usually I go to sleep pretty quickly, but the status of politics in this country probably keeps everyone up. (Laughs) But usually I’m just daydreaming about different things, whether it’s personal or something to do with the magazine. And new ideas, imaginations, travel destinations, things like that. I’m always thinking of what’s next in my life, so that takes up a lot of my headspace when I have free time.

And now the lightly edited transcript of the Mr. Magazine™ interview with Gemma Peckham, publisher and editor, ROVA magazine.

Samir Husni: You’re embarking on this new venture, a print magazine, for millennials. Are you out of your mind?

Gemma Peckham: (Laughs) That is a very good question, and one that I’ve been asked numerous times. Sometimes I stop and wonder if I’ve gone a bit crazy, but I think those segments of millennials and younger people who are really into things that are a little bit retro, and who want authenticity and something that they can actually touch and hold; perhaps they even have a little bit of Internet fatigue, you know? There is a lot of scope for a magazine like ROVA, which is a niche area for these millennials who are out there on the road traveling. What I’m hoping is that it sticks to them and they enjoy reading it every few months.

Samir Husni: Not only is there a tendency for people to think you might be crazy because this magazine is targeted toward millennials and it’s in print, but you might be considered double-crazy because it’s for millennials who also like to travel in RV’s, rather than retirees. When most people think about RV travelers, retirees come to mind. What was your thinking on this?

Gemma Peckham: I’m from Australia and it came about because I work at a publishing company there, which I’ve brought here to New York, and we had a magazine there for RV traveling and it was called “Caravanning Australia” and it was very targeted toward the retired market, the audience had an average age of about 60 or so.

When I decided to come here and bring the company over to the states, I looked at RVing here, because obviously we have experience in that area. And I did a bit of research and one of the things that I discovered was that the largest group of people buying RV’s currently is between the ages of 35-44. So, the demographic is slowly, but surely getting younger.

And that seemed very positive to me, because I’ve been all over RVing myself, and I’m just a millennial, right on the cusp between a millennial and Gen X, and I’ve driven an RV across the states, around New Zealand, and in Europe. And to me there is a culture there that is really growing that isn’t necessarily catered to by any of the publications out there at the moment. The main RV magazines in America are “MotorHome” and “Trailer Life” and they do incredibly well. They’re geared toward the older, retired RV users, but there is this whole contingent of people who are missing out on a quality, print product that speaks to them and shows the kind of experiences that they want.

So, we set up shop and we’ll see how it goes. There’s obviously a bit of a lack in the market. We thought that we could reach a younger audience and appeal to millennials. And we’re giving it a shot. We’ll see how it goes. So far, the feedback has been great. We’ve managed to sell some advertising, and obviously that was a very important thing. I’m hoping that it will keep growing.

Samir Husni: As I look at the first issue, which recently hit newsstands, what was the biggest challenge that you had to face in launching it and how did you overcome that challenge?

Gemma Peckham: Number one for us is this is the very first magazine that we’ve made in the United States. So, in terms of just making people aware of who we are and what we do, and then also trying to communicate the idea for this magazine to them was a bit of a challenge. And I guess that relates to advertising as well, as you said, some people asked were we crazy for doing a print magazine for millennials who are RV enthusiasts. They thought it was a very strange concept.

Being able to communicate this vision that was something a bit different and probably unexpected was a bit of a challenge. But when you have something that you really believe in as we do, it’s easier. I have a vested interest in it just because this is the kind of stuff that I love. Our sales team is really excited about the product, so all of that has really helped to communicate to people what we’re doing. And it’s turned out well. In the first edition we have something like 15-16 advertisers, and in the next edition, which we’re working on now, we have a similar amount already, so it looks like it’s going to be a little bit bigger.

In terms of challenges, just really making ourselves known and getting the word out about what we’re doing would be the number one challenge.

Samir Husni: You wrote in the first issue that you started ROVA because you love road travel and you love print magazines. So, is it a magazine based on passion? How are you combining the passion part with the business part?

Gemma Peckham: It’s definitely a bit of both. When I was in Australia I tried to start a similar magazine, but it was more global travel than RV travel. And that was something that was definitely a passion for me, because I have traveled a lot and it was something that I felt really strongly about. And I think we did have a really strong niche for that magazine, but it was competing with a lot of other travel magazines and it just wasn’t getting the advertising that it needed to. From that experience I learned that it doesn’t really matter how much passion you have for something, if it doesn’t fit into a market in some way, it may not work.

But in ROVA’s case, this is both. The stories that we have here and the kind of content that I’m curating for the magazine is really what I would like to read and other travelers that I know would like to read. We’ve created the design so that it appeals to people in my age group. But by the same token, I’m fully aware of the fact that we really need to make sure that what we’re putting into the magazine is really appealing to advertisers, because without them it’s not going to work.

We’ve put a lot of effort into marketing; we had a 1,000 followers on Instagram before the magazine was even launched, which was great. It’s really a matter of balancing the two. I’ve been working in magazine publishing for 10 years and over that time I’ve learned that no matter how much you want something to work, it’s not going to unless you have a business plan in place as well.

Samir Husni: Tell me a little about your future plans. You’ve established a magazine and yourselves in the United States; what’s next? Is ROVA going to be the entire ball of wax or you have other things in the works?

Gemma Peckham: We definitely have more plans. ROVA is obviously our flagship publication at the moment, it’s the one we’ve been able to promote and it’s doing quite well. We think it’s doing quite well from the feedback we’re getting. The plan for ROVA is just to grow it, make it bigger and get it out there, and build on that. But Executive Media Global is a publishing company that’s based on a model in Australia where we have 50 or 60 different titles that we produce every year.

So, what we’re trying to do here is build a publishing company in a similar way and it will take a while. We already have another magazine that we’re working on, which is a custom publication for a private club in New York City, in Manhattan. What we do for them is produce a magazine for their membership and the magazine is sent to every member of this club, as well as targeted to essential members. So, that’s another aspect of the business that we established in Australia and we’re trying to establish here, custom publishing on behalf of organizations, clubs and those sorts of things. And that’s what we’re looking at for the moment, just trying to get some partnerships happening and build a stable of publications.

Samir Husni: What is your mechanism for connecting ROVA, the printed magazine, with its audience?

Gemma Peckham: Digital is a big part of it for us, simply because that’s where millennials and Gen Xer’s go to get their information. Other than that, we’re going toward a number of RV shows. For example, Escapees, which is a big RV club and they have a big yearly event. So, we have a booth and we’re going out there, where we’ll actually be talking to people and connecting with them, and showing them the magazine. We have plans to do a few of those over the next few months to get this first edition out there.

Other than that, just reaching out to PR companies; sending out press releases. We’ve been interviewed by a couple of the online RV news sources, industry people, manufacturers and dealers. So, it’s really just a matter of finding the kinds of people that we think would disseminate this kind of information, putting ourselves in front of them and hoping they see enough value in our product to tell their audiences about it.

Samir Husni: Content-wise, you mentioned that you’ve taken a few trips in the United States, Australia and New Zealand. Did you find any differences between traveling with RV’s here, in the United States, versus other countries?

Gemma Peckham: It’s very similar in one way, which is the size of the country. The size of the U.S. is very similar to the size of Australia. Road trips are a really big part of the way people explore their own countries. So, that’s very similar, both here and in Australia.

But I do think that in the United States there’s a bigger group of younger people who are doing this. What they’re trying to do is get out and see their country, have these really authentic experiences. They’re all about living life on their own terms, so they’re trying to make a life for themselves that they enjoy. A lot of them work through this too; they call themselves digital nomads. So, they might be graphic designers or writers or photographers. There’s a lot of that happening here; instead of people doing a normal 9 to 5 job, they decide to get out and work from there. And I think that’s something that’s a lot bigger here than it is in Australia. In general though, the cultures are pretty similar. Hit the road, drive to the place that you’ve always wanted to see, interact with people along the way, and just enjoy yourselves.

Samir Husni: I noticed that the company that’s publishing the magazine, Executive Media Global, lists not only New York, but Sydney, Melbourne and Adelaide. Any plans to take the magazine to Australia?

Gemma Peckham: I don’t know. I believe Australia is moving in a similar direction with the age of the people who are taking up the RV way of traveling. It could work. I think probably what we would do, because this is a very U.S.-centric publication, we could potentially make an Australian focus, and I think that’s definitely something that isn’t out of the question. It’s something that we have the resources to do.

The thing with launching a magazine here as opposed to in Australia, we just have such a huge audience as a population; I can’t remember what exactly the difference in population is, but it’s quite substantial. Australia only has 20-25 million people, where the U.S. is around 370 million. I think ROVA is working because we really do have a large audience, but in Australia, we did very well with “Caravanning Australia” magazine, so it’s definitely something we’ll look at down the road.

Samir Husni: Is there anything that you’d like to add?

Gemma Peckham: The main thing that I’m experiencing is I have been so overwhelmingly pleased with the feedback that we’ve gotten and the way that people receive new magazines here. It’s very different than t is in Australia; people really give you kudos if you have an idea and you take it to the market and if you have passion behind the product, I think that people react in a really positive way. And that’s something that I’ve been really surprised by; the support and encouragement that we’ve gotten for this magazine. And that’s one of the things that make me happiest and most satisfied doing this, just seeing the reaction from people. And feeling like that we’re on the right track.

Samir Husni: If I showed up at your home unexpectedly one evening, what would I find you doing; watching TV with a glass of wine; flipping through a magazine; or on the road in an RV?

Gemma Peckham: (Laughs) It will depend upon how hard the day was. After a very hard day, yes, it will be binge-watching TV and having a glass of wine. Otherwise, I know it’s very strange, since I work in publishing, but I like to read when I go home. I’ll read the latest book that has caught my attention, or just having dinner with my husband and chatting, just catching up on the day. Or I’ll go to the gym, if I’m feeling really energetic.

Samir Husni: Are those books you read ink on paper or e-books?

Gemma Peckham: Right now, I’m reading a paper book. But generally, I read on my Kindle, because it’s so much easier to store, because I travel with it. I just love being able to carry a 1,000 books with me if I want to.

Samir Husni: My typical last question; what keeps you up at night?

Gemma Peckham: Good question. Usually I go to sleep pretty quickly, but the status of politics in this country probably keeps everyone up. (Laughs) But usually I’m just daydreaming about different things, whether it’s personal or something to do with the magazine. And new ideas, imaginations, travel destinations, things like that. I’m always thinking of what’s next in my life, so that takes up a lot of my headspace when I have free time.

Samir Husni: Thank you.

“A few other people have said that I was crazy to launch a print magazine and that I really needed to be in the digital space, but part of it is a personal passion, having a background in design and loving objects and paper and magazines. So, the print part was very important to me. But also our audience is 6 to 11-year-old girls, so they’re not really consuming online media in a way that say, a 12 to 13-year-old girl would, so the in-print aspect of it was important to us. But plenty of people asked and still ask what in the world was I thinking.” Samantha Razook Murphy…

A community of confident, inquisitive girls between the ages of six and 11, who like to make things, is the heart of Curious Jane magazine. And the woman who pumps that heart with her passion and dedication is its founder, Samantha Razook Murphy.

I spoke with Samantha recently and we talked about the genesis of Curious Jane, the projects and the summer programs, and we talked about Curious Jane, the magazine. All of which fall under one brand that has become quite popular with its audience and with those readers’ parents. Samantha actually gave birth to the idea for a great summer camp when her own two daughters were small and has worked hard to grow the business since then. The magazine was launched two years ago and has become an incredible tool to promote the brand and engage with readers. Today, you don’t have to live in the NYC area (which is where Curious Jane originates from, Brooklyn to be exact) to have a Curious Jane experience. It’s happening for girls all across America with the magazine.

So, I hope that you enjoy this interview with a woman who believes empowering young girls to “think with their hands” and be curious, while learning to create at the same time, is done best through an environment of projects, programs and print, Samantha Razook Murphy, founder, Curious Jane.

But first the sound-bites:

On the genesis of Curious Jane: When I started Curious Jane, I literally opened up a bank account with $500, so there wasn’t a business plan, it wasn’t funded, anything like that. It was just its own truck, sort of motoring down the road. And when we received this grant we were able to use some of that to work with a group, focus on how we might grow Curious Jane and the business. And one of the ideas that came out of it was taking all of these projects and activities that we had developed over the years with the summer camps and repackaging it into an in-print magazine for girls that was ad-free, subscription-based, so that girls in different parts of the country who certainly couldn’t actually attend the camp due to geography could be a part of the Curious Jane experience. And girls who were a part of our programs could continue to have those projects during the schoolyear, instead of just during the summers.

On whether anyone told her she was crazy to start a print magazine in this digital age: This man I was chatting with said to me that just because I was getting bored with the camps didn’t mean that I should start a magazine. And that was a pretty eye-opening statement, but it did help me to reframe. We continued with the magazine though, and I actually had lunch with him recently and told him that we had continued, but that his statement was very helpful in reframing my thoughts about it and about how the numbers work around the magazine.

On how she chose the name Curious Jane: The fact that there is a Curious George and that people know it and it sort of rolls off the tongue has certainly worked in our favor. Honestly, I think it was right before the first summer of camp and I was thinking about what to name this little thing that I was doing for my young daughters in order for me to be able to work, and I truly think it was one day when I was walking back from the laundromat and thinking what was the most important attribute that I wanted to instill in my girls? And it was curiosity. And something that I say even now when I work with girls is, think with your hands. Take the thinking out of your head and think with your hands.

On the biggest challenge that she’s had to face: I think the biggest challenge that we’ve had and continue to have is how to make it a financially positive aspect of what we do. When we started we had a very small subscriber base, a lot of them were our campers and people who knew us. And then about a year and a half into it, a mother of one of our camper’s works with a group called Sterling Publishing. She came to me and asked whether I had ever thought about doing a book of our projects. And I told her that in my mind a book meant taking a lot of time and resources and not making any money. We’re such a small business, wearing a million different hats; I can’t devote the resources to that. And she said that they wanted to make it really easy on me by taking all of the content that we’ve produced for the magazine so far and repackage it for the book.

On her most pleasant moment: Every time we work on the magazine is the most pleasant moment. We have a great time working on the projects and the fun little tidbits that have come up into it. A lot of things have changed from the first issue, in both the trim size and the layout. With my background in industrial design, something that I think has benefitted me is the comfort level I have of getting something to prototype stage and then getting it into people’s hands, and seeing the feedback we get and how we feel about it.

On how she met Jack Kliger and John Griffin: I met someone who knew Jack, and when I was telling this woman that we had just printed the first pre-issue of the magazine, she said she knew a few people who might be of help. I wrote down their names and she asked if I would like her to connect me with them. And one of them was Jack. And at that time we were looking for funding, we’re always open to it. But I specifically wanted to pick his brain and get as much advice as I could, so I met him for coffee. And at that point I understood what his very large and successful background in publishing and magazines was, and something that I really appreciated was he was willing to talk to someone who had only printed the second issue of a magazine. It was ad-free, we had 250 subscribers and he was able to give me very specific and useful suggestions for the magazine. About a week later, he called me and asked me was I interested in a little bit of funding and taking on an advisory board. He had another friend, John Griffin, who he wanted me to meet. So, that’s how I met them. And then they did ultimately become investors, but really advisors, and not just in the magazine, but in Curious Jane as a company.

On anything that she would like to add: Via the magazine, which has been a great tool for us, when I think of Curious Jane, it started as a camp, now we have a magazine; I really think of it as a community. I want it to feel like a community for girls, where they make things and feel empowered and self-confident. And to remove fear of failure is really at the core of that as well. In the past couple of years we have been able to work with a few organizations that have a national audience, Amy Poehler, Smart Girls, Parents Magazine, Family Fun, and we have our book coming out, so these types of collaborations with other groups, and likeminded organizations are something that we really enjoy and that we want to encourage and continue to grow.

The Curious Jane team: Melisa Coburn (L) – editorial, Samantha Razook Murphy (M) brainstorming, projects and layout, and
Elissa Josse (R) – artwork, doodles, layout and project creation.

On what drives her and makes her get out of bed every morning: All of the things that drive me are getting to work with the amazing people that I work with; we’re a small office year round. There are three to four of us; a tremendous, awesome, fun group. And then during the summer we hire about 100 to 120 young women to work with us, and the type of people that Curious Jane attracts to work with the girls over the summer is outstanding. So, getting to work with them is a complete honor.

On what someone would find her doing if they showed up unexpectedly to her home one evening: I really value the evening time. You would find me cooking; I find that to be really enjoyable and relaxing. I put a lot of value on the family meal in the evenings. My older daughter is quite musical, and what you will find in my small, cozy, warm apartment is cooking and music and candles, things like that. I don’t have a television and I don’t really consume digital media, but I guess a lot of people don’t have a television anymore; they use their computers for that sort of thing.

On what keeps her up at night: That’s a good question and I have a very specific answer, which is that I constantly run numbers in my head. I’m very fortunate that I have two girls, sort of a reconstructed family, and none of these things keep me up at night. Everyone is doing great, knock wood. As far as enjoyment of my workday, all of that is wonderful. It’s the numbers and how to keep the business moving forward.

And now the lightly edited transcription of the Mr. Magazine™ interview with Samantha Razook Murphy, founder, Curious Jane.

Samir Husni: There seems to be a movement when it comes to launching new magazines for girls. In the last two or three years, I’ve seen at least five or six magazines that have come to the marketplace and each one of them are one-of-a-kind. Tell me about the genesis of Curious Jane.

Samantha Razook Murphy: I have two daughters; they’re now 13 and 15. And I started Curious Jane nine years ago. It really started as a summer camp and continues as a summer camp. I did my undergraduate degree in Graphic Design at Yale, and then I moved to Brooklyn and did my master’s in Industrial Design at Pratt. And both of my girls were born by that time. They were young during the summers when I was pursuing my master’s at Pratt, and I directed all-girls residential programs on college campuses, so that’s how I go into the all-girls summer camp environment.

And then 2008/2009 rolled around and the economy took a nosedive and at that time my husband and I had to get a bit creative with what we did and how we stayed in Brooklyn, so I started an overnight camp program because that’s what I was familiar with and used to. But I needed something for my own girls to do; they were early elementary school aged, so I started Curious Jane. And it began truly as something for them and their friends to do during the summer months while I tried to get this overnight camp for girls off the ground.

That was the summer of 2009 and I hired a couple of instructors; I rented a van from a rental place in the city, we were living in Brooklyn and still do, and literally drove the camp van, picked up their friends, dropped them off at a school where we had rented some classrooms and the teachers were the instructors who taught the programs.

So, from that first summer of Curious Jane, the way the camp worked was girls could sign up for a week or two or three weeks, and then they would choose their favorite theme for the week. And all of the themes revolved around science, engineering and design. And that’s still what we do. That first summer we had just a handful of girls, but they could take a week-long class called “Why Buildings Stand Up,” which was architecture and engineering combined. They could take a week of “Toy Design.” So, these were the types of things that were the foundation of Curious Jane.

Then over the years Curious Jane really grew. People were really receptive to it; the girls loved it; the parents loved the idea of it, and in the end the residential programs certainly didn’t grow at the same pace and ultimately shrank. So, we stopped running the overnight program and only focused on Curious Jane. We added things like after-school programs, and we did run it in a few other states, but now we just focus on the New York City area.

In 2014, we applied for and did receive a small business grant; we are for-profit, so the word “grant” is a little bit misleading, but we applied via Chase through a program they had at the time called “Mission Small Business” and it was an unrestricted quarter of a million dollars. It was pretty competitive, I think there were around 35,000 applicants, and we were one of 12 recipients. And that helped us continue doing what we were doing and it also gave us the opportunity to work with, for the first time, a business development group and they were wonderful.

When I started Curious Jane, I literally opened up a bank account with $500, so there wasn’t a business plan, it wasn’t funded, anything like that. It was just its own truck, sort of motoring down the road. And when we received this grant we were able to use some of that to work with a group, focus on how we might grow Curious Jane and the business. And one of the ideas that came out of it was taking all of these projects and activities that we had developed over the years with the summer camps and repackaging it into an in-print magazine for girls that was ad-free, subscription-based, so that girls in different parts of the country who certainly couldn’t actually attend the camp due to geography could be a part of the Curious Jane experience. And girls who were a part of our programs could continue to have those projects during the schoolyear, instead of just during the summers.

We have been printing the magazine itself for two years now and it comes out quarterly. I think the issue you have is the “Super Silly” issue, and most of our issues revolve around our popular camp themes and we have used those projects to repackage into a magazine. The “Super Silly” issue was kind of a fun departure from that. It was a little bit more lighthearted and filled with different craft projects. But for example, some of the others were a “Spa Science” issue, girls could make anything to do with bath products and spas, and also learn about science in the process. We had a “Spy Science” one, which is very popular at classic camp, which is learning about detective work and things like that.

Samir Husni: You took your passion and your necessity and created Curious Jane, both the summer programs and the magazine. Did anybody tell you that you were out of your mind to start a print magazine for girls in this digital age?

Samantha Razook Murphy: Actually, there was a conversation that I had a couple of years ago, because when we started the magazine it wasn’t as though we were receiving additional funding, the camp business was what was funding and continues to fund the magazine, so a couple of years ago before I met Jack (Kliger) and John (Griffin), I had lunch with a brother of a friend of mine and he has a private equity group, and his group particularly focuses on grants, so it’s sort of a niche area for private equity. And I think at that time we had printed the first, very slim pre-issue of the magazine at great expense, and when I say “we” I mean our small office of two to three people, where most of what we do is other business and then we have a sunny space in the office where we do all of the photography and layout, because my background is in graphic design; all of that is done in-house.

So, this man I was chatting with said to me that just because I was getting bored with the camps didn’t mean that I should start a magazine. And that was a pretty eye-opening statement, but it did help me to reframe. We continued with the magazine though, and I actually had lunch with him recently and told him that we had continued, but that his statement was very helpful in reframing my thoughts about it and about how the numbers work around the magazine.

And then a few other people have said that I was crazy to launch a print magazine and that I really needed to be in the digital space, but part of it is a personal passion, having a background in design and loving objects and paper and magazines. So, the print part was very important to me. But also our audience is 6 to 11-year-old girls, so they’re not really consuming online media in a way that say, a 12 to 13-year-old girl would, so the in-print aspect of it was important to us. But plenty of people asked and still ask what in the world was I thinking.

Samir Husni: I know the name Curious Jane is obvious, but tell me how you chose that name. Everybody knows Curious George. Is it the fact that you have two girls and you didn’t want them reading Curious George, you wanted them to have their own magazine?

Samantha Razook Murphy: The fact that there is a Curious George and that people know it and it sort of rolls off the tongue has certainly worked in our favor. Honestly, I think it was right before the first summer of camp and I was thinking about what to name this little thing that I was doing for my young daughters in order for me to be able to work, and I truly think it was one day when I was walking back from the laundromat and thinking what was the most important attribute that I wanted to instill in my girls? And it was curiosity. And something that I say even now when I work with girls is, think with your hands. Take the thinking out of your head and think with your hands.

Having spent eight years in an educational environment, graphic and industrial design, we’re basically studio classes. I mean, everyday you’re putting your work in front of someone and having it critiqued and talked about and given feedback on. So this idea of continuing to be curious and collaborative, and to feel comfortable putting yourself and your work out into the world in order to learn and grow from it, rather than to feel defensive about it, private about it, or shutdown about it; the idea of curiosity is very important to me for myself, my girls and what we do as a business. So, that word was set. And Jane is just the idea that I wanted it to reference every girl, Jane being a sort of “every girl” theme.

Samir Husni: What has been the biggest challenge that you’ve had to face and how have you overcome it?

Samantha Razook Murphy: I think the biggest challenge that we’ve had and continue to have is how to make it a financially positive aspect of what we do. When we started we had a very small subscriber base, a lot of them were our campers and people who knew us. And then about a year and a half into it, a mother of one of our camper’s works with a group called Sterling Publishing. She came to me and asked whether I had ever thought about doing a book of our projects. And I told her that in my mind a book meant taking a lot of time and resources and not making any money. We’re such a small business, wearing a million different hats; I can’t devote the resources to that. And she said that they wanted to make it really easy on me by taking all of the content that we’ve produced for the magazine so far and repackage it for the book.

That helped us continue the magazine and it sort of balanced out the cost that we were using to get the magazine off the ground. In order to produce this book, she made it very easy on us. Sterling happens to be owned by Barnes & Noble and so via that she asked why I didn’t send some magazines over to the woman who runs newsstand for Barnes & Noble. And we did that, and she has been incredibly supportive. So, the issue that you picked up at Barnes & Noble is actually only the second issue that has been on newsstand.

The obstacle has been how do we continue to print this, grow the word, get it into girls’ hands, and thrive as a business.

Samir Husni: And what has been the most pleasant moment?

Samantha Razook Murphy: Every time we work on the magazine is the most pleasant moment. We have a great time working on the projects and the fun little tidbits that have come up into it. A lot of things have changed from the first issue, in both the trim size and the layout. With my background in industrial design, something that I think has benefitted me is the comfort level I have of getting something to prototype stage and then getting it into people’s hands, and seeing the feedback we get and how we feel about it.

So, the most pleasurable moments of all have been seeing the magazine itself. And I continue to look forward to working on it. Even for the next issue, which we’re working on now; we have new ideas for how we want to change a few things, really include more girls, that sort of thing. This growing organic product has been a huge amount of pleasure to me, and then also just the chance to actually work on the magazine is great fun.

Samir Husni: How did you meet Jack Kliger and John Griffin? These are giant names in the industry.

Samantha Razook Murphy: I really enjoy talking to people, learning about business, growing a business, and Curious Jane itself is a female-started and female-run business that, like I said, was started with $500 in the bank. A few years ago, we did cross the one million in revenue mark, which is somewhat of an indicator. So, we started connecting to other people in the business world. I like to meet other people. And they would tell me that more female business representatives were needed at such and such dinner and if I could please come.

So, through those channels I met someone who knew Jack, and when I was telling this woman that we had just printed the first pre-issue of the magazine, she said she knew a few people who might be of help. I wrote down their names and she asked if I would like her to connect me with them. And one of them was Jack. And at that time we were looking for funding, we’re always open to it. But I specifically wanted to pick his brain and get as much advice as I could, so I met him for coffee.

And at that point I understood what his very large and successful background in publishing and magazines was, and something that I really appreciated was he was willing to talk to someone who had only printed the second issue of a magazine. It was ad-free, we had 250 subscribers and he was able to give me very specific and useful suggestions for the magazine. About a week later, he called me and asked me was I interested in a little bit of funding and taking on an advisory board. He had another friend, John Griffin, who he wanted me to meet. So, that’s how I met them. And then they did ultimately become investors, but really advisors, and not just in the magazine, but in Curious Jane as a company.

Samir Husni: Is there anything that you’d like to add?

Samantha Razook Murphy: What I would add is that we’re a small business, but we are completely committed to getting this off the ground and growing it. What I’m doing now is reaching out to as many people as possible to continue to spread the word, to grow subscriber base; and what I’m looking for is, in general, feedback and thoughts. I’m very open in that way in connecting and working with people.

Via the magazine, which has been a great tool for us, when I think of Curious Jane, it started as a camp, now we have a magazine; I really think of it as a community. I want it to feel like a community for girls, where they make things and feel empowered and self-confident. And to remove fear of failure is really at the core of that as well. In the past couple of years we have been able to work with a few organizations that have a national audience, Amy Poehler, Smart Girls, Parents Magazine, Family Fun, and we have our book coming out, so these types of collaborations with other groups, and likeminded organizations are something that we really enjoy and that we want to encourage and continue to grow.

Samir Husni: If someone were to stop you on the street and tell you that they had seen your brochure and that they knew you were the founder of Curious Jane. And they knew what all you did, summer programs, workshops, events and a magazine. And they asked you, with all of that, what drives you? What makes you get out of bed in the morning; everything or one thing in particular?

Samantha Razook Murphy: I do love getting out of bed every morning and coming to Curious Jane. That is something that I value so highly and have a great appreciation for. I actually had this conversation with my 15-year-old daughter the other night and we were talking about if you’re with a new social group, especially for adults, and they ask the common question: what do you do? And I said to her sometimes Eleanor, I’ll say to the person that I’m happy to tell you what I do, but something that’s even more relevant to me is “what do I enjoy about what I do?”

So, all of the things that drive me are getting to work with the amazing people that I work with; we’re a small office year round. There are three to four of us; a tremendous, awesome, fun group. And then during the summer we hire about 100 to 120 young women to work with us, and the type of people that Curious Jane attracts to work with the girls over the summer is outstanding. So, getting to work with them is a complete honor.

Getting to have a balance to my day; you know, sometimes it’s admin and paperwork, sometimes it’s getting to do photos for the magazine, sometimes it’s trying out a new project; there is so much variety. And then also there is challenge and that’s a complete pleasure. So, I would say that these things that create a work environment or a professional environment are what I enjoy so much. And then also I get to do something that has such a strong, positive social mission, and that’s a real treat.

Samir Husni: If I showed up unexpectedly to your home one evening, what would I find you doing; reading a magazine; doing some designing; having a glass of wine; or something else?

Samantha Razook Murphy: I really value the evening time. You would find me cooking; I find that to be really enjoyable and relaxing. I put a lot of value on the family meal in the evenings. My older daughter is quite musical, and what you will find in my small, cozy, warm apartment is cooking and music and candles, things like that. I don’t have a television and I don’t really consume digital media, but I guess a lot of people don’t have a television anymore; they use their computers for that sort of thing. What you’ll see when you walk in is a guitar, a keyboard, a bass, a kitchen, a dining table, which is where we eat and do homework. It’s where we do crafts, when the opportunity arises I like to make things. But really the office is a great place to make things. And that’s what you would find me doing in the evening.

Samir Husni: My typical last question; what keeps you up at night?

Samantha Razook Murphy: That’s a good question and I have a very specific answer, which is that I constantly run numbers in my head. I’m very fortunate that I have two girls, sort of a reconstructed family, and none of these things keep me up at night. Everyone is doing great, knock wood. As far as enjoyment of my workday, all of that is wonderful. It’s the numbers and how to keep the business moving forward.

Samir Husni: Thank you.

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Magazines Matter. Print Matters. That is the theme for the Magazine Innovation Center’s ACT (Amplify, Clarify, Testify) 7 Experience that will take place April 25 to 27. Space is limited, so check the agenda and register to join us for an experience of a life-time.

A Mr. Magazine™ Launch Story…

“How valuable is print? Well, it’s incredibly valuable within the context of coexisting with online, because if I think of all of those people at BMG Records working away, they all look at email newsfeeds every morning. Then when you walk into their reception area, there are print magazines everywhere. And both have to exist, they each have their role.” Ian Peel…

Ink on Paper and vinyl records have always had an easy courtship. From Rolling Stone to Spin, these music magazine couplings usually turned into magic. That is, until the world decided both genres were dead or dying a slow, digital death. Of course, those with their fingers on the pulse of both industries knew that evolution did not necessarily mean extinction. In the 21st century our airspace is large enough for turntables and iPods; tablets and print magazines; and just about anything else the innovatively, creative human mind can come up with. No reason to fret.

And that’s exactly what the founder and editor at large of Long Live Vinyl magazine knew when he thought about the many ways you could make a print publication about vinyl records interesting in this day and age. As simple as “American Pie” really.

Ian Peel is a freelance journalist, marketing consultant, and magazine thinker and maker. He has contributed his fresh and innovative ideas to Anthem Publishing in the U.K., and so far, together, the two have created Classic Pop and Long Live Vinyl magazines, which are both increasing their frequency from bimonthlies to monthlies. Not bad for two industries that are on the verge of extinction, hmm?

I spoke with Ian recently and we talked about the newest edition to the fold, Long Live Vinyl, and about the creative design, a 12-inch format that, as Ian put it, lacks only the hole in the middle to actually fit on a turntable. Ian is a man with two obvious passions: music and magazines. And his adoration for both runs deep, as I soon learned early in our conversation when I asked him what he’d say to people who would accuse him of using two dying or vanishing industries to create this magazine. His answer: I’d say to them they’re not dying, they’re changing. And his success is proof of that belief.

So, I hope that you enjoy this look into the relationship between magazines and music, because just like Diana Ross & Lionel Richie sang: it’s an “Endless Love.” OK – music puns are over – enjoy the Mr. Magazine™ interview with Ian Peel, Founder and Editor At Large, Long Live Vinyl magazine.

But first the sound-bites:

On that moment of conception for the magazine and how he brought it to fruition: I started to talk to the team at Anthem Publishing about my ideas; how you could do a really interesting magazine about vinyl records. And of course this happened at the exact same time that the vinyl revival began. So, they thought about it for about two years, and then eventually we decided to give it a go.

On what he would say to those who would criticize him about combining two supposedly vanishing industries (print & vinyl) to create a new magazine: What would I say to them? Well, I’d say that these industries aren’t really dying, they’re changing. And with the changing times too, you have to be really, really bold, and try and strike out and do something new. When vinyl and magazines were both flourishing, it was probably harder to take risks, so it might have been harder to have done this 10 years ago, because there was far too much in the publishing world and the music world, so it was easy for people to just sit back and carry on with what they were doing and had always done. But when people’s backs are against the wall they have to be a bit more creative and daring. So, that’s what we did.

On why he thinks it took the magazine industry so long to realize that print and digital must co-exist with each other: Sometimes it’s just easier, isn’t it; to keep doing the same thing all of the time. And this is why maybe it was quite an interesting role for me, because I’ve never launched a magazine before Classic Pop. What I had been doing was working in the music business creating CD compilations and album reissues, and then trying to sell them into the media to get press coverage. So, I was coming from a slightly removed standpoint, and I was finding it very difficult in the case of classic pop music to get the page space in the traditional music magazines and newspapers.

On the biggest challenge he’s had to face: I don’t know if it was a challenge, but there was always a concern that I was just in a bubble and no one else would agree or see the value in it. That was a concern. There’s always this challenge that you have to create the magazine, or at least the structure and the style, before the publisher can start selling ad space, so there is a challenge, which is to get over that initial hump of going from concept to actually being able to gauge the revenue that the publication can generate.

On his most pleasant moment: When Anthem said yes, it was a surprise, because don’t forget, I had pitched Long Live Vinyl about two years ago to them, so they had sat very quietly and watched the vinyl revival grow for two years and remembered the proposal. So, it was a nice surprise when they phoned and said we will do this. We will make it happen.

On whether he thinks he could have achieved what he’s achieved with just a digital platform and no print component: We could have, but there are lots of vinyl blogs out there already, and I really like them. In fact, it’s interesting, because when I was devising Long Live Vinyl, there were some really great websites about vinyl, in terms of how they looked and what they said and their viewpoint. And I thought, none of that exists in print. There wasn’t a cool, contemporary vinyl print magazine. So, there was another reason, to replicate how far forward with vinyl journalism the Internet had moved.

On what role he will play at Long Live Vinyl now that he’s there full-time: On the masthead I’m founder plus editor at large. And in fact, that’s the title for both Classic Pop and Long Live Vinyl. So, that involves something that Anthem is quite keen on, and that is monitoring and developing what they call the DNA of the magazine. And I think they know from experience that it’s possible for the DNA to drift if it’s not sat up on a regular basis. And that could be anything from a font that someone has used temporarily for one issue that still accidentally in place 10 issues later, because no one has sat down and had a proper font discussion. Or it could be about the tone of voice that’s used.

On anything new he’s working on now: Yes. (Laughs) The third one is going to be brilliant. (Laughs again) Classic Pop was great and exists in its own way; Long Live Vinyl is kind of broader and a slightly wider platform, then the third idea is broader and wider still, but with a quite unique sense of purpose.

On whether he believes we’re seeing a return to a broader-topic type magazine with a niche audience, rather than a niche magazine itself: That’s a very interesting question, actually, because I think that one of the reasons that Classic Pop magazine did very well is that the four or five music magazines in the U.K. are all general list. They’ll have a Rock front cover, then they’ll have an Electronic front cover, and that was fine in the ‘70s and ‘80s, when the only way that you could get music content was to buy a magazine. They were duty-bound to cover all of the genres. But now that I can’t avoid music content, it’s coming out of my phone, computer, TV and everywhere, I think the job of the magazine is to be specialists, to celebrate more specialist areas.

On what advice he would offer to someone who came to him with an idea for starting a new magazine: If someone has a great idea for a print magazine, then I would encourage them to go and see a print publisher, because you’re taking them a revenue stream. And it would be great if that idea for a print magazine had really good unique content. And maybe you do start to blog, but I think if what we’re asking is, would it be best to do it online for a year and see how it goes, the answer is no, because you’re creating a totally different product than the one that you wanted to create in the first place. The best case scenario is they coexist together, straight on.

On what someone would find him doing if they showed up unexpectedly at his home one evening: There’s quite an easy answer to that, which is, as soon as the magazine goes to bed, I go straight on to the next one. And it’s because it’s like this weird zone that you get into, when you’re finishing an issue, you just can’t stop. You’re on a roll.

On what keeps him up at night: (Laughs) I think the easy answer to that is the idea for magazine number three. It does keep me up at night, because when I look at this proposal, I’m excited. I’m excited and happy to read the proposal through.

And now the lightly edited transcript of the Mr. Magazine™ interview with Ian Peel, founder and editor at large, Long Live Vinyl magazine.

Samir Husni: Can you relive that moment of conception, that moment when you came up with the idea for Long Live Vinyl, and how did you bring it to fruition?

Ian Peel: It’s quite a long story, so I’ll try and give you the abridged version. There’s a magazine in the U.K. called “Record Collector” and I started writing for them when I left school in 1988. And I had lots of fun, really, writing for them. But I always had strong views as to how you could do a magazine for people who loved vinyl and loved records. And I would pitch these ideas to Record Collector over the years at different times and in the intervening 25 years. And some of those ideas they listened to and took onboard and some of them they didn’t.

Then flash forward to 2011when I had a great idea for a magazine about Pop music that I called “Classic Pop.” I went to Anthem Publishing and they really jumped onboard; they loved the idea. They set the magazine up and we made it a great success, so Classic Pop has been running for three years as a bimonthly.

And once that was doing really well and it was in supermarkets in the U.K., I started to talk to the team at Anthem Publishing about my ideas; how you could do a really interesting magazine about vinyl records. And of course this happened at the exact same time that the vinyl revival began. So, they thought about it for about two years, and then eventually we decided to give it a go.

We did a test issue for Long Live Vinyl in November, 2016. I wasn’t hugely involved in anything other than conception with that, because I was doing a long consultancy with a record label called BMG, so I was working in-house with them on lots of vinyl releases as it happens. Aside from kind of setting Anthem Publishing up with the idea for Long Live Vinyl, and some very strict notes initially about pitching and selling in stage around two or three years ago, I left them to go ahead and put the magazine together.

One of the most exciting things was seeing Issue One on the shelves in November and it being pretty much exactly what I’d hoped for and exactly what I had dreamt we could do. All that time ago during the pitching process, I’d written really detailed notes about the style, tone and how the pages should be laid out; the type of fonts that should be used and the writers that should be in the magazine, and they worked through all of those notes and it came out really well. So, it was a good team effort, albeit quite remotely for me during Issue One.

So, then we sat back and looked at how Issue One had sold in November, and it sold very well and advertisers had picked up on it, so it was enough for me to leave BMG, and as of this month, turn Long Live Vinyl into a monthly magazine. We go monthly in April, and at the same time, we’re going to expand the remit of Classic Pop magazine, which is really the forerunner of Long Live Vinyl, and that will switch from bimonthly into a monthly in May.

Samir Husni: What would you tell the naysayers who might come to you saying that you are taking two supposedly dying or vanishing industries and combining them to create a very well-crafted, beautiful, album-sized magazine?

Ian Peel: What would I say to them? Well, I’d say that these industries aren’t really dying, they’re changing. And with the changing times too, you have to be really, really bold, and try and strike out and do something new. When vinyl and magazines were both flourishing, it was probably harder to take risks, so it might have been harder to have done this 10 years ago, because there was far too much in the publishing world and the music world, so it was easy for people to just sit back and carry on with what they were doing and had always done. But when people’s backs are against the wall they have to be a bit more creative and daring. So, that’s what we did.

And it was quite daring to do the magazine in 12-inch form, which was one of the initial ideas that we came up with. I wanted to go one step further and that was put a hole through the middle. (Laughs)

Samir Husni: (Laughs too).

Ian Peel: But I couldn’t get approval on that. We’re still going to drill some holes though, for promotional type things.

Samir Husni: If we consider magazine makers the most creative people around, why do you think it took the magazine industry so long, almost a decade, to recognize that print isn’t going anywhere; digital isn’t going anywhere, and we have to live in an environment where all forms of media exist?

Ian Peel: Sometimes it’s just easier, isn’t it; to keep doing the same thing all of the time. And this is why maybe it was quite an interesting role for me, because I’ve never launched a magazine before Classic Pop. What I had been doing was working in the music business creating CD compilations and album reissues, and then trying to sell them into the media to get press coverage. So, I was coming from a slightly removed standpoint, and I was finding it very difficult in the case of classic pop music to get the page space in the traditional music magazines and newspapers.

But I knew there was a market for it, because there were festivals and they were booming and the CD and music business was booming with classic pop music, and there were television stations launching. It became quite clear that it should be very straightforward for a magazine to work in tandem with all of those other areas of media. So, why do we find it difficult? I don’t know, maybe a lack of objectivity.

Samir Husni: What has been the biggest challenge that you’ve had to face and how did you overcome it?

Ian Peel: I don’t know if it was a challenge, but there was always a concern that I was just in a bubble and no one else would agree or see the value in it. That was a concern. There’s always this challenge that you have to create the magazine, or at least the structure and the style, before the publisher can start selling ad space, so there is a challenge, which is to get over that initial hump of going from concept to actually being able to gauge the revenue that the publication can generate.

With Classic Pop magazine, it was a challenge to get certain businesses onboard, in terms of seeing its value, but not so with Long Live Vinyl. Every record label is producing vinyl editions, and when I went out to them; it was like a one-word pitch. What’s the magazine? Vinyl. And then they were straight onboard. So, it wasn’t too much of a tough sell in that respect.

There is this other magazine that has existed in the U.K. for a long time called “Record Collector” that I’ve written for and that gave me my first job in journalism. And I love that magazine; I have a lot of respect for it. And long may it continue. But I set myself the challenge of looking and feeling completely different that the Record Collector, in terms of tone of voice, type of photography used, because I wanted them to carry on being successful in their world, and I wanted us to be successful in ours. And I also wanted to avoid any confusion between potential readers as to what to buy.

Samir Husni: What has been the most pleasant moment? Was it when Anthem said yes?

Ian Peel: Well, when Anthem said yes, it was a surprise, because don’t forget, I had pitched Long Live Vinyl about two years ago to them, so they had sat very quietly and watched the vinyl revival grow for two years and remembered the proposal. So, it was a nice surprise when they phoned and said we will do this. We will make it happen.

I think the nicest part of it was as I described earlier when I saw the first issue. Once I’d gone off into the corporate world and seen that we’re all on the same page, it was great; all of my notes and ideas really gelled with theirs. That’s always a worry, especially if people work remotely, in different offices, emailing, rather than sitting at the same desk. To realize that everyone is thinking along the same lines is great. On which note I should mention Andy Jones, the editor of Issue One, who did a great job, and Jon Bickley, who is the CEO of Anthem Publishing and a big vinyl lover. And a big music fan. The two of them especially, and then Simon Lewis, who is our commercial and advertising man It didn’t take too much description on my part, we could see what it could be quite quickly.

Samir Husni: You combine your passion, music/journalism, and you’re in the music industry, you’ve worked with the labels; what value do you think print, as opposed to digital, brings to this genre? Could you have done what you’ve done with just a digital platform?

Ian Peel: We could have, but there are lots of vinyl blogs out there already, and I really like them. In fact, it’s interesting, because when I was devising Long Live Vinyl, there were some really great websites about vinyl, in terms of how they looked and what they said and their viewpoint. And I thought, none of that exists in print. There wasn’t a cool, contemporary vinyl print magazine. So, there was another reason, to replicate how far forward with vinyl journalism the Internet had moved.

How valuable is print? Well, it’s incredibly valuable within the context of coexisting with online, because if I think of all of those people at BMG Records working away, they all look at email newsfeeds every morning. Then when you walk into their reception area, there are print magazines everywhere. And both have to exist, they each have their role.

Samir Husni: Now that you’re at the magazine full-time, what role will you play at Long Live Vinyl? Are you going to be the editor in chief or the editorial director?

Ian Peel: On the masthead I’m founder plus editor at large. And in fact, that’s the title for both Classic Pop and Long Live Vinyl. So, that involves something that Anthem is quite keen on, and that is monitoring and developing what they call the DNA of the magazine. And I think they know from experience that it’s possible for the DNA to drift if it’s not sat up on a regular basis. And that could be anything from a font that someone has used temporarily for one issue that still accidentally in place 10 issues later, because no one has sat down and had a proper font discussion. Or it could be about the tone of voice that’s used.

So, really I will be monitoring and measuring the DNA of both publications, while at the same time I’m doing lots and lots of writing. For issue two of Long Live Vinyl, I will be news editor and reviews editor. With Classic Pop, I think I wrote 80 percent of the first issue, partly to build structures and templates for the different sections so everyone could just go off and replicate.

Samir Husni: After Long Live Vinyl, is there anything else in the hopper; something new that you’re working on now?

Ian Peel: Yes. (Laughs) The third one is going to be brilliant. (Laughs again)

Samir Husni: (Laughs too).

Ian Peel: Classic Pop was great and exists in its own way; Long Live Vinyl is kind of broader and a slightly wider platform, then the third idea is broader and wider still, but with a quite unique sense of purpose.

Samir Husni: Are we seeing a return from the ultra-niche magazines, or what you refer to in the U.K. as the “Patchwork” magazines, to a broader topic type magazine with a very niche audience, rather than a niche magazine?

Ian Peel: That’s a very interesting question, actually, because I think that one of the reasons that Classic Pop magazine did very well is that the four or five music magazines in the U.K. are all general list. They’ll have a Rock front cover, then they’ll have an Electronic front cover, and that was fine in the ‘70s and ‘80s, when the only way that you could get music content was to buy a magazine. They were duty-bound to cover all of the genres. But now that I can’t avoid music content, it’s coming out of my phone, computer, TV and everywhere, I think the job of the magazine is to be specialists, to celebrate more specialist areas.

So, Pop is a specialist area; vinyl is a specialist area, because people are in love and they want to read about vinyl for one, number two, is what’s on it, the actual music that’s on it. But the number one reason is the love of vinyl.

With my third project, it’s broader, but you’re right, it has to have an absolute purpose and that purpose might actually be quite niche, and that audience might actually be quite niche. Even if it’s maybe covering, without giving too much away, various area of entertainment, there has to be a twist or a particular unifying factor.

Samir Husni: You’re a believer in print and bringing new ideas to the forefront, and you’re also, it would seem, more of a believer in protecting that DNA. So, if somebody comes to you and tells you that they have an idea for a new magazine, a new print entity; what do you tell them? You’re out of your mind, go start a blog, or you offer them different advice?

Ian Peel: If someone has a great idea for a print magazine, then I would encourage them to go and see a print publisher, because you’re taking them a revenue stream. And it would be great if that idea for a print magazine had really good unique content. And maybe you do start to blog, but I think if what we’re asking is, would it be best to do it online for a year and see how it goes, the answer is no, because you’re creating a totally different product than the one that you wanted to create in the first place. The best case scenario is they coexist together, straight on.

Even with Long Live Vinyl, two or three years ago when I first pitched it, Anthem did say why don’t you start it as a section within Classic Pop magazine, and as a section within Vintage Rock, which is another of their print music listing magazines. But from the start we created it asking the question: how would it look in print? As opposed to let’s start a Twitter page and see how many people we can amass.

So, I think if someone came up with a great print idea, they have to absolutely work hard to get it into print. And then bring everything else along with it. I would encourage someone, instead of starting a blog; I’d encourage them to mock up the first issue, to lay out the pages and think about the type of paper or the page size, and what other print magazines that it would sit alongside.

Samir Husni: If I show up at your house unexpectedly one evening, what do I find you doing; reading a magazine; playing your vinyl; watching television; having a glass of wine; or something else?

Ian Peel: There’s quite an easy answer to that, which is, as soon as the magazine goes to bed, I go straight on to the next one. And it’s because it’s like this weird zone that you get into, when you’re finishing an issue, you just can’t stop. You’re on a roll.

And that’s why I think that bimonthly magazines are quite hard, because there’s that dip for readers and potential purchasers, of two months, where they might forget about you in the middle of those two months. But there’s also this kind of dip in energy between the two months, which is why a monthly is great. It keeps the energy levels up all of the time. With Classic Pop, when it was bimonthly, I would literally finish one article and start making the next one, because I couldn’t get out of the zone.

Samir Husni: My typical last question; what keeps you up at night?

Ian Peel: (Laughs) I think the easy answer to that is the idea for magazine number three. It does keep me up at night, because when I look at this proposal, I’m excited. I’m excited and happy to read the proposal through.

Also, whether these ideas work or not, it’s a lot of fun and very rewarding to put them together and to try them.

Samir Husni: Thank you.

A Mr. Magazine™ Launch Story…

“As you know, print is a very different experience than online. And people consume media in different ways; they consume information in different ways. And it’s been amazing to me to see what has been happening in bookstores; people picking up the magazine and writing to me. Or they’ll pick up Volume II and order Volume I directly from me. The physical presence of the magazine creates its own type of awakening that’s different from what happens on the Internet. Plus there’s just the beauty of the design itself; it’s a very different experience than you get online. One of the things that I’m trying to do with the magazine is to present other species as individuals and as being as real as humans. And I don’t think that you get that when you’re looking at pictures on the Internet. When you see it in the beautiful way that Jane lays it out in the magazine, it has a different, more powerful impact.” Kathryn Arnold (on why she felt her mission needed a print magazine)

We humans have been put in charge of planet Earth. Its water, food supply and wildlife are all under our supervision and dominion. Unfortunately, sometimes we are not the best of caretakers. We tend to put other, more personal intentions ahead of what’s best for the biodiversity of our planet. That’s when checks and balances are called into play. And one of those indicators comes in the form of a new magazine: Wild Hope.

Wild Hope’s co-creator, or story curator, as she calls herself, is Kathryn Arnold, former editor in chief of Yoga Journal. Kathryn has over 30 years’ experience in the business of magazines, having worked at many titles throughout her career. But it was when she started volunteering at a marine mammal center that she began to realize she knew very little about the planet we all live on. So, she went back to school and got a degree in Natural History. And the rest, as they say, is…well, history.

Today, she is in the business of trying to help save planet Earth and all of its living creatures that are threatened or endangered in one way or another. Bringing awareness through a beautiful print magazine that is elegantly put together and quite a joy to read: Wild Hope.

I spoke with Kathryn recently and we talked about the birth of this beautiful new infant, and about how she plans on sustaining it and using it as a tool for awareness of many of our planet’s biodiversity issues. From a little porpoise in the Gulf of California called a Vaquita, to the individuality of each animal that exists, Kathryn’s passion to help is evident with every page of Wild Hope.

And as we all need, and must have hope to exist; sometimes it takes a braver, wilder hope to sustain something as uniquely complex and beautiful as Mother Earth and all of her inhabitants. So, enjoy the Mr. Magazine™ interview with a woman who has that kind of hope, Kathryn Arnold, story curator, Wild Hope magazine.

But first the sound-bites:

On why she refers to her position at the magazine as story curator: I’m calling myself that, a “story curator,” because that’s really what I’m doing. I’ve spent my career as a magazine editor or a book editor, but in creating Wild Hope, what I’m doing is reaching out to my community of veterinarians, wildlife rehabilitators, conservationists and biologists who aren’t necessarily professional writers. I encourage them to tell us their personal stories about the work that they’re doing to help save Earth’s biodiversity.

On that moment of conception with Wild Hope: The story has a few points to it; one, back in 2002 I began volunteering at a place here in Marin County called The Marine Mammal Center, taking care of the animals that we rescued and admitted, then rehabilitated and released back into the wild. And that awakened me to the fact that I knew very little about the ecosystem that I lived in. So, that set me on the path to go back to school and get a degree in Natural History. So, the idea to create Wild Hope came out of that wanting to share the hope that I had and that I had gleaned from being in that community; I wanted to share that hope among the community to lift their spirits.

On the business model for the magazine: I spent 30 years in magazine publishing, so I’m very familiar with the traditional models, both in consumer and B to B publishing. I have years of working within that model. And when I started Wild Hope, my intentions were not to try and emulate that model. It began with becoming a 501(c)(3); I was adopted as a fiscal sponsor of Earth Island Institute, so I am a project of the Earth Island Institute, so that provide me with 501 (c)(3) status. My approach has been to be sort of a crowdsourced magazine, if you will. And to not necessarily think of it as something that’s going to be financially successful in the traditional sense of a magazine, but successful in terms of raising people’s awareness of our need to save our biodiversity. It’s really mission-driven; it’s not financial-driven.

On why she thinks it’s important that the magazine’s mission has a print component: As you know, print is a very different experience than online. And people consume media in different ways; they consume information in different ways. And it’s been amazing to me to see what has been happening in bookstores; people picking up the magazine and writing to me. Or they’ll pick up Volume II and order Volume I directly from me. The physical presence of the magazine creates its own type of awakening that’s different from what happens on the Internet.

On how she feels the role of editor in chief has changed over the years: I’ve certainly seen it change. I began my career at Working Woman magazine in the 1980s and from there went to Savvy magazine, and from there went to New Hope Natural Media in Boulder, Colorado. And then from there to Yoga Journal, and through my career I definitely saw the role of editor in chief changing from one of being an editor and creator of experiences to one of being a marketer. The content selection became all about what’s going to sell the magazine and what’s going to sell advertising.

On her feelings when she held that first issue of Wild Hope in her hand: It was definitely like holding a newborn for me. I’m a very self-critical individual (Laughs), so I can always see the flaws in the work that I do. And because this was something that became so central to my value system; it became a driving motivation for me to get the magazine done and to start this conversation in a bigger way than just talking to friends.

On the biggest challenge she thinks she will face: It’s going to be interesting to see how it plays out. In the first issue, every one of the stories came from either a direct experience I’d had, or from someone who knew someone who could contribute the stories or the photographs. But then after the first issue, I started receiving submissions from people I didn’t know. And that’s been true of the third issue as well. So, I think that’s going to be my greatest challenge going forward. Will that be sustainable, or am I going to have to start assigning stories at some point? Will this organic system of submissions continue?

On what someone would find her doing if they showed up unexpectedly at her home one evening: Actually, I work a full-time job that’s not Wild Hope. I am the marketing and communications manager for Spirit Rock Meditation Center here in Marin. So, if you were to come over to my house in the evenings, what you would find me doing is working on Wild Hope. (Laughs)

On what keeps her up at night: The challenges that accompany the work that I’m trying to do and the work of the people who are contributing to Wild Hope. The challenges to those efforts are what keep me up at night.

And now the lightly edited transcript of the Mr. Magazine™ interview with Kathryn Arnold, Story Curator, Wild Hope magazine.

Samir Husni: I’ve seen a lot of magazines and magazine mastheads throughout my career, but I have never seen one that refers to a “story curator” as you do for your own position at Wild Hope magazine. Tell me about that new title that you have created for yourself.

Kathryn Arnold: I’m calling myself that, a “story curator,” because that’s really what I’m doing. I’ve spent my career as a magazine editor or a book editor, but in creating Wild Hope, what I’m doing is reaching out to my community of veterinarians, wildlife rehabilitators, conservationists and biologists who aren’t necessarily professional writers. I encourage them to tell us their personal stories about the work that they’re doing to help save Earth’s biodiversity. So, really, I’m curating their stories as opposed to what you would conventionally think of a magazine editor doing, things like assigning stories. I’m not assigning stories; I’m collecting stories. And then I’m shaping them into a magazine that I hope will inspire others to engage in saving Earth’s biodiversity.

Samir Husni: Tell me about that moment of conception with Wild Hope. What clicked in your brain and made you think that you needed to do a print magazine about this topic?

Kathryn Arnold: The story has a few points to it; one, back in 2002 I began volunteering at a place here in Marin County called The Marine Mammal Center, taking care of the animals that we rescued and admitted, then rehabilitated and released back into the wild. And that awakened me to the fact that I knew very little about the ecosystem that I lived in. So, that set me on the path to go back to school and get a degree in Natural History.

And along the way, I met so many other people who were engaged in the work of saving other species. And I found it very inspiring, yet among that community I also felt that there was a great deal of despair.

So, the idea to create Wild Hope came out of that wanting to share the hope that I had and that I had gleaned from being in that community; I wanted to share that hope among the community to lift their spirits. I first thought of it as a website, because truthfully, it was less expensive to do.

But then I was inspired by two former staffers that worked with me at Yoga Journal. I used to be the editor in chief of Yoga Journal. They were two young people on my staff who launched their own print magazine. And honestly, my protégés inspired me to start a print publication, and then I just happened to meet up with Jane Palecek at a “Women in Publishing” conference and mentioned to her my concept. And Jane told me that she would be happy to partner with me on the magazine and help to create it. And of course, Jane was an award-winning designer at Afar magazine and she was also at Mother Jones.

So, it was those factors that compelled me to start Wild Hope. Me wanting to create a place where people in this community who were engaged in saving wildlife could talk to each other and lift each other’s spirits and know that we’re all not alone. There was this huge community of people out there who were endeavoring to save Earth’s biodiversity. I wanted to bring them together in a magazine and lift their spirits. And then when my own protégés inspired me to start a magazine, and meeting up with Jane during that mindset; those factors coming together inspired me to start Wild Hope.

Samir Husni: You’re following your passion, this is something that you’ve been involved with and something that you’ve volunteered for; this is the heart part of launching the magazine. Where does the brain part of launching Wild Hope come in? What is your business model for surviving in this day and age?

Kathryn Arnold: I spent 30 years in magazine publishing, so I’m very familiar with the traditional models, both in consumer and B to B publishing. I have years of working within that model. And when I started Wild Hope, my intentions were not to try and emulate that model. It began with becoming a 501(c)(3); I was adopted as a fiscal sponsor of Earth Island Institute, so I am a project of the Earth Island Institute, so that provide me with 501 (c)(3) status.

My approach has been to be sort of a crowdsourced magazine, if you will. And to not necessarily think of it as something that’s going to be financially successful in the traditional sense of a magazine, but successful in terms of raising people’s awareness of our need to save our biodiversity. It’s really mission-driven; it’s not financial-driven.

We found an amazing printer in Minnesota that can actually print a quality magazine for less than you can have it printed for in China. And I have priced the magazine at a point where we can make the print-run cost with each issue. And all of our contributors are contributing for free. So, that’s our business model. And it’s definitely mission-driven; everybody that’s contributing is doing so because this mission is so important to them, to help raise awareness and to help share the stories.

I am growing the magazine gradually. I started out with zero distribution, and it was picked up by Small Changes, a distributor out of Seattle. They were the first distributor to pick me up. And then most recently, I was picked up by Disticor Distribution. So, we’ve gone from zero distribution in bookstores to, with the printing of the third issue, which is now at the printer, a distribution of 3,400 copies in bookstores. So, I’m growing it very slowly, gradually and strategically. I intend for the magazine to be able to wash its face (Laughs); for it to break even with every issue.

So, the distribution is growing gradually as people discover the magazine, and bookstores have also been contacting the distributors. It’s a very careful strategy that appears to be working. But I’m not creating this magazine for the sake of creating one as a business. It’s all grounded in the mission.

Samir Husni: Why do you think it’s important for that mission to have a print component in this digital age?

Kathryn Arnold: As you know, print is a very different experience than online. And people consume media in different ways; they consume information in different ways. And it’s been amazing to me to see what has been happening in bookstores; people picking up the magazine
and writing to me. Or they’ll pick up Volume II and order Volume I directly from me. The physical presence of the magazine creates its own type of awakening that’s different from what happens on the Internet.

Plus there’s just the beauty of the design itself; it’s a very different experience than you get online. One of the things that I’m trying to do with the magazine is to present other species as individuals and as being as real as humans. And I don’t think that you get that when you’re looking at pictures on the Internet. When you see it in the beautiful way that Jane lays it out in the magazine, it has a different, more powerful impact.

Samir Husni: From your experience as editor in chief of Yoga Journal for many years, and now the story curator for Wild Hope; how has the role of a magazine editor evolved or changed over the years?

Kathryn Arnold: (Laughs) I’ve certainly seen it change. I began my career at Working Woman magazine in the 1980s and from there went to Savvy magazine, and from there went to New Hope Natural Media in Boulder, Colorado. And then from there I went to Yoga Journal, and through my career I definitely saw the role of editor in chief changing from one of being an editor and creator of experiences to one of being a marketer. The content selection became all about what’s going to sell the magazine and what’s going to sell advertising.

I think it moved away from delivering content that was of value first to the reader. I was always tried to balance that in my positions, but the editor in chief’s job has become mainly one of a marketer. And it does also depend on the magazine. Certainly, there are those where that isn’t true, but I think at the really big circulation magazines that is what’s happening. And even at smaller niche magazines like Yoga Journal, special interest magazines; it’s all about that market.

Samir Husni: Once that first issue of Wild Hope arrived and you held that magazine in your hand; what was the degree of satisfaction for you? Was it like holding a newborn baby; or more like, finally it’s done?

Kathryn Arnold: It was definitely like holding a newborn for me. I’m a very self-critical individual (Laughs), so I can always see the flaws in the work that I do. And because this was something that became so central to my value system; it became a driving motivation for me to get the magazine done and to start this conversation in a bigger way than just talking to friends.

It was this feeling of having actualized something from inside me that was of core importance to me and to the people I know. And then to get the really positive response to it, which let me know that I had done something worthwhile and would continue.

Samir Husni: What do you think will be the biggest challenge that you’re going to face raising this newborn?

Kathryn Arnold: It’s going to be interesting to see how it plays out. In the first issue, every one of the stories came from either a direct experience I’d had, or from someone who knew someone who could contribute the stories or the photographs. But then after the first issue, I started receiving submissions from people I didn’t know. And that’s been true of the third issue as well. So, I think that’s going to be my greatest challenge going forward. Will that be sustainable, or am I going to have to start assigning stories at some point? Will this organic system of submissions continue?

It’s been amazing to receive these stories from people I don’t know and who want to be a part of Wild Hope. That feeds my hope that I am on the right path here, but I think that will be my greatest challenge. I just don’t know if that can be sustained. And because I’m being so cautious about distribution and the printing and all of that, I’m not concerned that I can’t sustain the financial model, it’s whether I can sustain my story curation model.

Samir Husni: As I flipped through the pages of the first issue, I can’t remember the last time that I’ve seen a magazine that had the binding sewn; I can actually see the stitches in the binding. It’s not glued or saddle stitched, which gives it that feel of collectability. That sense of, this magazine isn’t going anywhere. You can actually lay the pages flat and they’re not going to break.

Kathryn Arnold: And I don’t want people throwing it away. Corporate Graphics is our printer and they do an amazing job. They are very inspired by the magazine and its editorial. And they’ve given us, what I think, is a very reasonable price, which includes the stitching. I highly recommend them to anyone interested in printing a magazine or something else. It’s great quality.

Samir Husni: If I showed up unexpectedly at your home one evening after work, what would I find you doing; reading a magazine; reading your iPad; having a glass of wine; watching television; or something else?

Kathryn Arnold: Actually, I work a full-time job that’s not Wild Hope. I am the marketing and communications manager for Spirit Rock Meditation Center here in Marin. So, if you were to come over to my house in the evenings, what you would find me doing is working on Wild Hope. (Laughs)

Samir Husni: My typical last question; what keeps you up at night?

Kathryn Arnold: The challenges that accompany the work that I’m trying to do and the work of the people who are contributing to Wild Hope. The challenges to those efforts are what keep me up at night.

For instance, in the Gulf of California, there is a small porpoise that’s on the edge of extinction called the Vaquita. There are probably fewer than 30 left due to the illegal gillnet fishing for another endangered species, a fish called the Totoaba. And it’s all because the swim bladder of this particular fish is prized in China. So, the Vaquita porpoise gets caught in the gillnets and drowns. And although the areas in which they inhabit, the Gulf of California, is off-limits to fishing, the poaching continues. So, the future doesn’t look very bright for the Vaquita.

And that’s the sort of thing that keeps me up at night. There are a lot of people who are engaged in rescuing the Vaquita, and we’re working with the government of Mexico to try and save them. So, that keeps me up at night; will we be able to save the Vaquita, or is it too late?

And I have that story in the next issue of Wild Hope. The question is can we bring enough light to this situation that even if the Vaquita is extinguished, it can be a call to action for the next endangered species? It’s a heroic effort to go in and try and save this little porpoise. But the next time, can we start sooner?

With the magazine, I’m trying to help others see wild species as individuals, because in my wildlife rehabilitation work it has become very clear to me that animals are as individual as humans are. You can’t just talk about a California sea lion; every California sea lion is different and has its own personality and needs just like we humans do. And that’s one of the things that I’m trying to do with Wild Hope. Not just show pictures of gorillas, but show pictures of a specific gorilla that has its own personality, which I believe you can see in the first issue. We’re trying to help people see other species as real as they do human beings. And to show that every species contributes to the web of life, and educate people about what it is that different species do contribute.

Samir Husni: Thank you.