Mr. Magazine

Pallet Is A New Title That Satisfies The Craft Beer Lovers “Palate” Exquisitely – The Mr. Magazine™ Interview With The Pallet Team…Rick Bannister & Nadia Saccardo, Founders, Pallet Magazine & Sam Calagione, Founder & President Dogfish Head Brewery & Pallet Executive Editor.

From Australia and The United States With Love and a Glass of Craft Beer…

“I am a big believer that there is this turning point now or in the very near future where people are being reminded of the luxury of reading offline. I know that myself, because when I’m online I have this low level of anxiety that comes with reading online because I feel like I can never get to the end of what’s ahead. There’s just endless information and I’m forever bookmarking things and saying I’ll come back to that later. And I do think there is this return to print and what that brings is you’ve invested some money, say $15, it’s not cheap, you’ve invested the money so you’re going to stop and make some time.” Rick Bannister

“We’re also not interested in objects that are just throwaways. We’ve spent so much time in this content and so much of ourselves; the idea of putting that in a magazine that people would toss and not keep around for a long time as something that they cherished just didn’t sit right.” Nadia Saccardo (on why they wanted the magazine’s production values of the highest quality)

“We see the website as just growing into a community for the people who believe in the magazine and in craft beer and who want to find each other. And that’s why I love the fact that the website isn’t just regurgitated content that we expect people to be holding in their hands; it’s something complementary to that content.” Sam Calagione (on the magazine’s content and the website’s content being totally different)

A new magazine for people who are “only interested in everything;” Pallet was born from the minds of Nadia Saccardo and Rick Bannister from Australia, joined by the craft beer expertise of Sam Calagione who is founder and president of Dogfish Head Brewery in Milton, Delaware. Coming from a background of magazines and publishing, Nadia and Rick knew a thing or two about the art of creative magazine making and joined forces with Sam to produce a title that weaves the craft beer culture into just about every topic you could possibly think of, and does it in a most upscale and visually creative way.

I spoke with Sam, Nadia and Rick recently about each one’s respective talent and ability to produce such a thoroughly enjoyable magazine as Pallet. With Nadia and Rick in Australia and Sam and myself in the States, we talked about what it took to collaborate the efforts of the indie beer lover’s magazine to be the catalyst for global knowledge and all-around fun about the world of craft beer.

When you consider the name Pallet was derived from a story that Nadia and Rick had done in a former magazine, Smith Journal, where they both worked at the time, you can see the type of creativeness and talent that the duo has. The pallet being the wooden element that changed the face of global shipping and transportation, but remains an insignificantly understated object, as inconspicuously important as a lock is to a key, yet as Nadia explained, something you wouldn’t look twice at if you walked past it. And if you couple Rick and Nadia’s magazine experience with Sam’s vision and global connections as a craft brewer, one can see why the three came together to produce this superbly understated magazine.

The four of us talked about that subtlety and the visual beauty of the magazine itself, with its high production values and brilliantly-done content. It was an entertaining and exceptionally redolent conversation, robust with humor, information and hope for the magazine’s future.

So, I hope you enjoy this launch story that showcases three very different individuals who came together, each with their own talent, to put together a remarkable magazine that shows sometimes great things begin simply – with one beer and one story; the Mr. Magazine™ interview with the Pallet team, Sam, Nadia and Rick.

But first, the sound-bites:

On how three people, two from Australia and one from the Unites States got together to create Pallet Magazine (Rick Bannister): Nadia (Saccardo) and I have both been in magazines our entire careers or in media and publishing in one form or another. I personally had worked in magazines for about 12 years and then decided that I wanted to try something different, so I went traveling for 12 months, to the States actually. And that’s where a good friend of mine over there introduced me to craft beer, which I hadn’t really come across in Australia much. My friend was going to do a brewing course in Chicago and I decided to join him. However, it ended up my friend couldn’t make it, but I went. So, I took a detour from making magazines for nearly five years and worked in the craft beer industry in Australia. During that time I started thinking about the fact that there wasn’t a magazine for all of the people who really loved the craft beer culture.

(Nadia Saccardo): Rick had had these great ideas and we decided to investigate it and that turned into, after his road trip to the United States, meeting a lot of people last year in publishing and in the craft brewing industry, and that developed into talking about the potential of this magazine, and it was also when we came down to Delaware and met Sam (Calagione).

On Pallet being more of an upscale magazine and very different from the beer magazines already on the marketplace (Sam Calagione): When I saw the work that Nadia and Rick were doing at Smith Journal and with a couple of my own thoughts about if a person is going to pay premium to have this sort of affordable luxury that they’re sipping on, then it means they’re taking the time to appreciate the finer things in life and they’re obviously enjoying a peaceful, reflective moment when they’re having a beer. And to me the things that complement that thoughtful, peaceful moment of enjoying a beautifully designed beer are two-fold: an awesome album or an awesome magazine. I don’t enjoy reading Kafka or War and Peace when I’m having a beer I want something that I can consume in about the same amount of time that it takes to consume my craft beer.

On how they came up with the name Pallet (Nadia Saccardo): Rick and I were throwing names back and forth for a while and then we had a story that we published in Smith Journal about the wooden pallet and about how this one very ubiquitous object had transformed the whole nature of global shipping and transportation. And we loved that story because it took a simple object, something that you’d walk past every day and not look at twice, and gave it this depth and history and relevance that was so vital.

On whether anyone ever told them they’d had one craft beer too many when it came to starting a print magazine in today’s world (Rick Bannister): It is definitely something that a lot of people ask us. And in a lot of ways, it is kind of insane to start a print magazine at this time, but also there is some element of the fact that it’s a great opportunity as well, because as you said Pallet stands out and in a time when there’s less of that stuff, I think you can look at it the other way and see the opportunity.

On how decisions are made for the magazine, such as the cover, design and content (Nadia Saccardo): We work in a partnership across the entire thing; the design; the production; the ideas; pretty much everything. We have a designer who we work with, Marta Roca, who is brilliant and helps across, obviously, designing the layout and with creative direction, but Rick and I really read the content in partnership. Rick is incredible. Most of the ideas come from his brain and then they roll out and get stuck into the words and the structural editing of the publication.

On any plans to incorporate the magazine into the Dogfish Head brewery business (Sam Calagione): That’s actually not far from the truth. I go to Australia in a few weeks to do some Pallet events and while the magazine launch is in the U.S., I think we all are hopeful, because the craft beer phenomenon isn’t just happening in the U.S.; adventurous, independent, small artful breweries are exploding globally, hot pockets of gold, including Australia, New Zealand, Scandinavia, Italy and Canada. We’re hopeful that there’s a global appetite for Pallet and that sort of second phase as you alluded to for us is that while we’re down in Australia we’re doing a collaborative beer between Dogfish and Nomad Brewing in the Sydney area. And Pallet will be a sort of a business card in liquid form for the philosophy and the global stance of the magazine.

On whether Sam sees himself now as the ambassador of craft beer and Pallet Magazine as the nation that will unite that corner of the world (Sam Calagione): I do see it like that and beer is not equal to armament; it’s fun. And the content and design and our intentions should come from a place that’s thought-provoking, but also there’s real whimsy in it; we’re beer geeks, we’re not beer snobs. We’re not trying to show our beer prowess to lord over other people.

On whether the magazine is available in Australia or just the United States for now (Nadia Saccardo): At the moment this edition on shelves is just available in North America, but we’re looking to expand internationally fairly quickly. We’ve had a lot of demand for Pallet in Australia, but also in the U.K. and Japan.

On the production values of the magazine and how the feel of the paper is important (Rick Bannister): I think when you’re paying premium for anything; it’s good to have perceptions of value that go beyond the normal. A change in stock is a subtle thing in a lot of ways, but if you’re a person who’s into this kind of stuff, you’ll get a little kick out of that. And it’s the same with the dust jacket on the cover; it’s a visual cue that maybe this is something more like a book, there’s an element to this that’s more than a magazine.

On the fact that the website and the print magazine will have entirely different content (Rick Bannister): Yes, that’s right. What we’ve noticed with other magazines and their websites is that quite often the website is just reflective of the magazine. And to us, that seemed to diminish the idea that what you have in print is special.

On what motivates Sam to get out of bed in the mornings (Sam Calagione): For me, honestly, when I travel to Australia and have to put on my customs form what I do; I’m always so proud to write that my vocation is a brewer first and a businessman second. Really, to me, the word brewer is just a more specific term for an artist and I don’t say that I’m a world-class artist; I’m just a person who loves brewing whatever my creativity brings me and I know that I’m very lucky that I can make my livelihood around my creative drive. And for me, those most creative moments come from collaborating with other creative people.

On whether Sam, as a brewer, thinks the first issue of Pallet is the perfect brew (Sam Calagione): (Laughs) The other form of Pallet is in our mouths and we’re all individuals and we all have different palates and that’s why there’s not one beer that appeals to everyone and that’s why there won’t be just one issue of Pallet that is perfect. I love the first issue, but I can’t wait to see where our creative journey takes us with each future issue.

On what motivates Nadia to get out of bed in the mornings (Nadia Saccardo): In creating something like Pallet, the thing that does get me out of bed in the mornings is working with the team that I get to work with and also the opportunity that the magazine provides to connect with anyone and anything that I’m interested in basically.

On whether the future of magazine making is doing so from varied parts of the world and not confined to one office (Nadia Saccardo): Rick and I laugh about it a lot. Pallet and none of the magazines that we have created, which have been beautiful, tangible printed things, could have existed without Skype. We’re on Skype together every day and we were when we were making Smith as well. Without technology, there would be no way we could create these old-world type printed things, which is very cool.

On what motivates Rick to get out of bed in the mornings (Rick Bannister): Mostly my kids jumping on me. (Laughs) Similar stuff to what these guys have said. As well as working in magazines, I’ve also taken breaks from working in magazines, because I’ve had these crazy ideas that I wanted to do other jobs. From time to time I’d say to myself, no, I just want to do a 9-5 job, so I’d go and become a baggage handler at the airport. One of the things that I think is a reminder for me when you get to work in those type jobs is you remember to get up, and even on the worst day ever of making a magazine, it’s still a far greater day than if you’re throwing bags on a plane, I can tell you that. What’s that old cliché? The worst day fishing is better than the best day working?

On what keeps Nadia up at night (Nadia Saccardo): The thing about making a magazine, it’s very different from reading a magazine. It’s not a glamourous profession at all. The business is all-consuming and we’re doing everything ourselves, from distribution to managing the printing to organizing sales and creating content and working on design, just everything. And running the business and making sure that we’re invoicing on time and all of that. So really, there’s a whirlpool of different things that keep me up at night. But it’s definitely worth it because so far it’s been such a cool journey.

On what keeps Rick up at night (Rick Bannister): I’m in the same boat as Nadia. It’s usually just silly things or small things like worrying about whether a photo shoot is going to come off the way you want it to or worrying about getting enough ad sales; I guess it’s just all of that normal startup business concerns, whether it’s magazines or anything else.

On what keeps Sam up at night (Sam Calagione): My reasons are a little bit different because Nadia and Rick are the ones that have to set the economic component of running Pallet and I get the pleasure of thinking about the creative and editorial content and obviously, they think a lot about that too, but that distinguishes me with the luxury of not having as much of an economic and business and operational component of running the publication. So, in the context of Pallet what keeps me up at night is an occasional idea for a new story and jotting that down or thinking about a story idea that maybe Rick or Nadia brought to me. It’s all the fun stuff that keeps me up, in terms of Pallet.

And now the lightly edited transcript of the Mr. Magazine™ interview with the Pallet team, Sam Calagione, Nadia Saccardo & Rick Bannister.

Samir Husni: I’m someone who’s “only interested in everything,” as your tagline states, so tell me how three people, two from Australia and one from the United States got together to create Pallet Magazine; where did the idea come from?

Rick Bannister: Nadia (Saccardo) and I have both been in magazines our entire careers or in media and publishing in one form or another. I personally had worked in magazines for about 12 years and then decided that I wanted to try something different, so I went traveling for 12 months, to the States actually. And that’s where a good friend of mine over there introduced me to craft beer, which I hadn’t really come across in Australia much. My friend was going to do a brewing course in Chicago and I decided to join him. However, it ended up my friend couldn’t make it, but I went.

So, I took a detour from making magazines for nearly five years and worked in the craft beer industry in Australia. During that time I started thinking about the fact that there wasn’t a magazine for all of the people who really loved the craft beer culture.

Well, at the end of those five years I had the opportunity to go back and work in magazines and that’s where I ended up working with Nadia. We worked together for about a year maybe and then the company that we were working for was sold.

So Nadia and I were at loose ends and that’s when we started kicking around some ideas. I asked her about the beer mag idea and it was Nadia who really encouraged it from there and said it was worth chasing.

Nadia Saccardo: We had a bunch of ideas and all of them seem to have a craft beer thread running through them. And so we pinpointed that we’d like to do something with craft beer. My background is in publishing; I worked online in digital for a while and I’ve been in magazines at Smith Journal and Frankie Press.

Rick had had these great ideas and we decided to investigate it and that turned into, after his road trip to the United States, meeting a lot of people last year in publishing and in the craft brewing industry, and that developed into talking about the potential of this magazine, and it was also when we came down to Delaware and met Sam (Calagione).

Rick Bannister: I should backtrack a little bit because it was Nadia who had the idea of reaching out to Sam. We were kind of inspired by Lucky Peach and David Chang is, I guess you’d call him a bit of a champion of the magazine. And so Nadia had the idea of finding out whom the person was in beer that was kind of like Lucky Peach’s David Chang. And straightaway we thought of Sam and with the whole ethos of what we were trying to do, this “only interested in everything” mentality; Sam was just the obvious guy who seemed to embody that spirit and philosophy.

A true connection in craft beer land; we just cold-called him, or cold-emailed him anyway, and being the generous guy he is, he said the idea sounded interesting and he asked to talk some more about it. We ended up landing on his doorstep and having a beer and chatting about it. And here we are.

Samir Husni: Sam, whose idea was it to do the magazine very differently from the other craft and beer magazines on the marketplace? Pallet is more upscale literarily, visually, typographically, and in an all-appealing way that by far stands apart from the competition.

Sam Calagione: Thank you, Samir. In a getting to know each other phase, Nadia and Rick sent me a box with copies of Smith Journal in it. And as a global magazine expert; I’m sure you’d be as equally impressed with that as I was, both from a design standpoint and a content standpoint.

Compared to you I’m a neophyte, but I’ve been kind of obsessed with magazines from an early age, and growing up my parents subscribed to Forbes and Sports Illustrated and I had an older sister who also subscribed to Sassy Magazine, which was kind of ahead of its time in having a very irreverent and DIY voice and fairly design-forward for a mass media magazine. And then in college Art Forum and The New Yorker. So, I’ve been obsessed with magazines as an English major and a bit of a writer myself for a long time.

So, when I saw the work that Nadia and Rick were doing at Smith Journal and with a couple of my own thoughts about if a person is going to pay premium to have this sort of affordable luxury that they’re sipping on, then it means they’re taking the time to appreciate the finer things in life and they’re obviously enjoying a peaceful, reflective moment when they’re having a beer. And to me the things that complement that thoughtful, peaceful moment of enjoying a beautifully designed beer are two-fold: an awesome album or an awesome magazine. I don’t enjoy reading Kafka or War and Peace when I’m having a beer I want something that I can consume in about the same amount of time that it takes to consume my craft beer.

And with the magazines that are out there; some of them are great and some of them are just OK, but they literally have long-format stories that can be a 20 or 30 minute experience, which to me is about the right amount of time to sip on a beer and read something thought-provoking and provocative.

Samir Husni: Can all of you recall that moment of conception when all the planets aligned and the light bulb went off and everyone said let’s call it Pallet? How did the name come about?

Nadia Saccardo: Rick and I were throwing names back and forth for a while and then we had a story that we published in Smith Journal about the wooden pallet and about how this one very ubiquitous object had transformed the whole nature of global shipping and transportation. And we loved that story because it took a simple object, something that you’d walk past every day and not look at twice, and gave it this depth and history and relevance that was so vital.

So, when we were thinking about this magazine and throwing around names, I remembered that story and asked Rick what about Pallet? And the more that we thought about it, the more we thought OK, that works. It goes back to something that we love that’s very simple and that still had the connection with beer. It’s a play on words in many ways, which also worked for us too. After a time, we sort of realized that we were stuck with it.

Samir Husni: Did anyone tell you guys that you’d had one too many craft beers when you decided to launch a print magazine in a digital age?

(Everyone laughs).

Sam Calagione: I’ve been asked that, Samir, and as someone who has studied the industry for as long as you have, what are your thoughts about the long-term viability of print, and particularly magazines like Pallet, or Pitchfork Review? They’re going after a younger reader with what’s considered a format that some people would say is a format of past generations; what are your thoughts on that?

Samir Husni: If you saw my recent quotes in the Columbia Journalism Review; I resigned my position as Chairman of the Journalism Department here at the University of Mississippi in 2009 to start the Magazine Innovation Center with the tagline “Amplifying the Future of Print in a Digital Age.” And to me as long as we have human beings, we’re going to have print. We love that collectability factor, that ownership factor, that membership factor and the showmanship of it all. If I’m reading something on my iPad, no one sitting next to me on the plane will know what I’m reading. How can I show off and say, hey look, I’m reading a $14.95 Pallet Magazine, this is not a cheap, disposable item? (Laughs)

(Everyone laughs too).

Rick Bannister: That’s a good point. It is definitely something that a lot of people ask us. And in a lot of ways, it is kind of insane to start a print magazine at this time, but also there is some element of the fact that it’s a great opportunity as well, because as you said Pallet stands out and in a time when there’s less of that stuff, I think you can look at it the other way and see the opportunity.

And I am a big believer that there is this turning point now or in the very near future where people are being reminded of the luxury of reading offline. I know that myself, because when I’m online I have this low level of anxiety that comes with reading online because I feel like I can never get to the end of what’s ahead. There’s just endless information and I’m forever bookmarking things and saying I’ll come back to that later. And I do think there is this return to print and what that brings is you’ve invested some money, say $15, it’s not cheap, you’ve invested the money so you’re going to stop and make some time. So, I think all of these things coming to light; it’s good timing for it in some ways.

Samir Husni: Nadia, are you more of the editor; the designer; or the creative person? For example, who decided on the cover of the first issue to introduce Pallet to the marketplace, or even the tagline: only interested in everything? And then inside you read the editorial and it states that this is a magazine for people who like to think and drink.

Nadia Saccardo: We work in a partnership across the entire thing; the design; the production; the ideas; pretty much everything. We have a designer who we work with, Marta Roca, who is brilliant and helps across, obviously, designing the layout and with creative direction, but Rick and I really read the content in partnership. Rick is incredible. Most of the ideas come from his brain and then they roll out and get stuck into the words and the structural editing of the publication.

So, it’s really a partnership between the two of us and also Sam, in terms of the flow and the ideas of the publication and contributing his pace as well to each issue.

Samir Husni: Sam, what are your plans when it comes to taking this magazine even one step further; are we going to start seeing on the craft beer that your company produces an offer to subscribe to Pallet?

Sam Calagione: That’s actually not far from the truth. I go to Australia in a few weeks to do some Pallet events and while the magazine launch is in the U.S., I think we all are hopeful, because the craft beer phenomenon isn’t just happening in the U.S.; adventurous, independent, small artful breweries are exploding globally, hot pockets of gold, including Australia, New Zealand, Scandinavia, Italy and Canada.

We’re hopeful that there’s a global appetite for Pallet and that sort of second phase as you alluded to for us is that while we’re down in Australia we’re doing a collaborative beer between Dogfish and Nomad Brewing in the Sydney area. And Pallet will be a sort of a business card in liquid form for the philosophy and the global stance of the magazine.

My contribution, besides creative input to the content when we have meetings before every issue to talk about that, and I’m glad to have a voice in that process, but also my contribution is a global outreach because I’ve done a Discovery channel show that aired in around 40 countries and because I’ve brewed collaborative beers with my friends in 11 different countries. And I’m lucky to have forged these global relationships with other brewers so that when Nadia and Rick suggest doing an article on beers that have been inspired by Breaking Bad, and they ask who I know in Canada, I can put out my bat signal to my friends around the globe and do that outreach for almost any creative story that we want to consider.

I have both the role of executive editor and writer, not always, but I intend to contribute short pieces, but also I have the role of that sort of global steward that keeps the magazine connected to the brewing community globally.

Samir Husni: So Sam, you see yourself now as the ambassador for craft beer, where Pallet is going to be the nation that unites all of these countries?

Sam Calagione: I do see it like that and beer is not equal to armament; it’s fun. And the content and design and our intentions should come from a place that’s thought-provoking, but also there’s real whimsy in it; we’re beer geeks, we’re not beer snobs. We’re not trying to show our beer prowess to lord over other people.

There’s going to be some content in this magazine that’s very specific to what’s exciting and creative about the world of beer and it’s not going to be influenced by the juggernauts that dominate the beer world with the advertising messages that sometimes run into editorial. This magazine is for indie beer lovers and the content isn’t always going to be about beer, but it’s content that has been curated through the lens of what beer lover’s want to read about in addition to wanting to read about beer.

Samir Husni: Are you going to launch Pallet in Australia or is it already available there? Or is it only available here in the United States for now?

Nadia Saccardo: At the moment this edition on shelves is just available in North America, but we’re looking to expand internationally fairly quickly. We’ve had a lot of demand for Pallet in Australia, but also in the U.K. and Japan.

Samir Husni: The choice for the paper reminded me somehow of Monocle; you’re using the matte paper and you’re using the glossy paper. How is the feel of the magazine important?

Rick Bannister: I think when you’re paying premium for anything; it’s good to have perceptions of value that go beyond the normal. A change in stock is a subtle thing in a lot of ways, but if you’re a person who’s into this kind of stuff, you’ll get a little kick out of that. And it’s the same with the dust jacket on the cover; it’s a visual cue that maybe this is something more like a book, there’s an element to this that’s more than a magazine.

Our printers tried to talk us out of making it such high quality many times. They told us it would be expensive and make the magazine heavy and they said that we didn’t need to have it like this. And that’s the printer. I thought that they would want us to spend more money with them.

But we wanted something that felt special to us and that’s where it all comes from really. And we hope that other people will appreciate the same thing.

Nadia Saccardo: We’re also not interested in objects that are just throwaways. We’ve spent so much time in this content and so much of ourselves; the idea of putting that in a magazine that people would toss and not keep around for a long time as something that they cherished just didn’t sit right.

Also, the waste, as you probably know, in the print and magazine industry is pretty dire and not something that we’re interested in contributing to, so if we can help by creating an object, as well as a great read, in hopes that people will hang onto it and keep it on their shelves for a long time and that’s a good thing.

Samir Husni: One thing that I keep telling anyone who is willing to listen is that we are much more than information; if ink on paper is just about content, we would have been dead a long time ago. We are about that lasting impression.

Nadia Saccardo: Yes, make it a nice thing with beautiful paper. It makes perfect sense.

Samir Husni: Is there anything else either of you would like to add? I read somewhere that none of the magazine’s content will be available on the website, is that right?

Rick Bannister: Yes, that’s right. What we’ve noticed with other magazines and their websites is that quite often the website is just reflective of the magazine. And to us, that seemed to diminish the idea that what you have in print is special.

We also saw the web as an opportunity. Websites work in such different ways and people consume information in such different ways that we took some time to think about that and came up with the idea that our content is that be-one-is-one story and is much more visually-driven and about small bits of information, but also builds this kind of global tapestry of this culture. You can see them and the website is complementary to the mag. We didn’t want to just roll out the same stuff.

Sam Calagione: Also we see the website as just growing into a community for the people who believe in the magazine and in craft beer and who want to find each other. And that’s why I love the fact that the website isn’t just regurgitated content that we expect people to be holding in their hands; it’s something complementary to that content.

Samir Husni: Sam, what motivates you to get out of bed in the mornings?

Sam Calagione: For me, honestly, when I travel to Australia and have to put on my customs form what I do; I’m always so proud to write that my vocation is a brewer first and a businessman second. Really, to me, the word brewer is just a more specific term for an artist and I don’t say that I’m a world-class artist; I’m just a person who loves brewing whatever my creativity brings me and I know that I’m very lucky that I can make my livelihood around my creative drive. And for me, those most creative moments come from collaborating with other creative people. Making that connection with people is why we’re here.

So, I see Pallet as another important layer of the awesome opportunity that I have to make my career and my vocation and my avocation, all the same thing, and to create and it be my livelihood.

Samir Husni: Do you think as a brewer, the first issue of Pallet is the perfect brew?

Sam Calagione: (Laughs) The other form of Pallet is in our mouths and we’re all individuals and we all have different palates and that’s why there’s not one beer that appeals to everyone and that’s why there won’t be just one issue of Pallet that is perfect. I love the first issue, but I can’t wait to see where our creative journey takes us with each future issue.

Samir Husni: Nadia, what motivates you to get out of bed in the mornings?

Nadia Saccardo: Well, some mornings it’s coffee. (Laughs) I started out in online publishing in city guides because I loved my city and I was really curious about finding interesting spaces and then I moved into print. It’s interesting when people showcase their spaces and also create objects that communicate their stories and resonate with other people.

And now in creating something like Pallet, the thing that does get me out of bed in the mornings is working with the team that I get to work with and also the opportunity that the magazine provides to connect with anyone and anything that I’m interested in basically.

It’s just an amazing thing to be able to sit down and speak to people and find out what makes them tick and also to highlight people who have done some incredible things and maybe would never get any recognition from other media sources, but will get to extract and connect with our audience. And that gives me a natural buzz. It’s an amazing responsibility in many ways, but it’s definitely what drives me.

Samir Husni: And are you based in Sydney or Melbourne?

Nadia Saccardo: I’m in Melbourne at the moment. I’m kind of drifting between Melbourne and the States.

Samir Husni: Rick, are you also in Melbourne?

Rick Bannister: No, I’m up near a place called Byron Bay, so it’s Northern New South Wales. It’s way out in the country.

Samir Husni: Technically, the three of you are in three different corners of the world, is this the future of magazine editing? Is this the future; you know, where we don’t need to have a central office on Madison Avenue in New York City, we can create a beautiful and lovely magazine from anywhere?

Nadia Saccardo: Rick and I laugh about it a lot. Pallet and none of the magazines that we have created, which have been beautiful, tangible printed things, could have existed without Skype. We’re on Skype together every day and we were when we were making Smith as well. Without technology, there would be no way we could create these old-world type printed things, which is very cool.

Samir Husni: It’s amazing. Putting today’s technology to use to create an old technology. Rick, what motivates you to get out of bed in the mornings?

Rick Bannister: Mostly my kids jumping on me. (Laughs) Similar stuff to what these guys have said. As well as working in magazines, I’ve also taken breaks from working in magazines, because I’ve had these crazy ideas that I wanted to do other jobs. From time to time I’d say to myself, no, I just want to do a 9-5 job, so I’d go and become a baggage handler at the airport. Or I’d go and become a laborer on a building site. And I’d always only last about 2 or 3 months.

I did this even last year when I went and worked in a food factory. One of the things that I think is a reminder for me when you get to work in those type jobs is you remember to get up, and even on the worst day ever of making a magazine, it’s still a far greater day than if you’re throwing bags on a plane, I can tell you that. What’s that old cliché? The worst day fishing is better than the best day working? It’s kind of that ethos. It’s not hard to get out of bed when all you’re going to do is talk to people you like and use your brain and be able to go and have coffee whenever you want.

Samir Husni: My typical last question and we’ll start with you, Nadia; what keeps you up at night?

Nadia Saccardo: Where do I start? The thing about making a magazine, it’s very different from reading a magazine. It’s not a glamourous profession at all. The business is all-consuming and we’re doing everything ourselves, from distribution to managing the printing to organizing sales and creating content and working on design, just everything. And running the business and making sure that we’re invoicing on time and all of that. So really, there’s a whirlpool of different things that keep me up at night. But it’s definitely worth it because so far it’s been such a cool journey. Also being on this side of the world, the interview times are terrible so they often keep me up at night.

Samir Husni: Rick, what keeps you up at night?

Rick Bannister: I’m in the same boat as Nadia. It’s usually just silly things or small things like worrying about whether a photo shoot is going to come off the way you want it to or worrying about getting enough ad sales; I guess it’s just all of that normal startup business concerns, whether it’s magazines or anything else.

We officially started in August, so we’re just in that stage where we’re still fighting for survival. There are just a lot of things to worry about.

Samir Husni: And Sam, what about you?

Sam Calagione: My reasons are a little bit different because Nadia and Rick are the ones that have to set the economic component of running Pallet and I get the pleasure of thinking about the creative and editorial content and obviously, they think a lot about that too, but that distinguishes me with the luxury of not having as much of an economic and business and operational component of running the publication.

So, in the context of Pallet what keeps me up at night is an occasional idea for a new story and jotting that down or thinking about a story idea that maybe Rick or Nadia brought to me. It’s all the fun stuff that keeps me up, in terms of Pallet.

Then of course, the business stuff that has to do with my own brewery and the 230 co-workers that I have at Dogfish Head and that’s where I have to worry about the economic and financial operational stuff. That’s really not what keeps me up; that’s what wakes me up about halfway through the night. (Laughs)

Samir Husni: Thank you all.